Hi Tim,
Another wood humidity question. I built a lovely rural/country home a
number of years ago (circa 2001) and then sold it in 2002 to move back into
the city (wife was not keen on the rural life).
When I sold the house, everything was fine (as you say, new homes have alot
of residual humidity). In winter 2005, the current home owner contacted me
and told me of gaps appearing in the floors. I sent someone by and they
reported that the relative humidity in the house was about 20% (nice for
breathing/living but below recommended +40% recommended for wood).
I recommended that they ensure that their humidistat be set correctly to
push 40+% humidity into the house at all times but they complained that in
extremely cold temperature, they get condensation on some windows, etc..
Well two years have passed and I now received a legal letter from that in
that they want me to replace the wood floors claiming it to be a latent
defect of the house. Irregardless of that, I am still trying to get them
to understand that it is moisture related issues and they have to take
action.
I have proposed that they fix their humidity level and wash the wood floors
with a damp mop (once a week) to re-humidify the wood (contrary to your
recommendation:
http://www.askthebuilder.com/B114_Hardwood_Floor_Maintenance_Guidelines.sht
ml). I think this would re-hydrate the wood (which is currently at 16%
humiidity), allow it to expand, reduce the gaps, and then setting the air
humidity at the right level would keep it there... what would be your
thoughts or recommendations?
Hardwood Floor Maintenance Guidelines
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Comments
Mike
10 Dec 2007, 15:10
10 Dec 2007, 15:10
AsktheBuilder
11 Dec 2007, 07:59
11 Dec 2007, 07:59
Mike,
This is a ridiculous situation if you have presented all of the facts. I am quite sure you can get data from the two Associations listed in this column that will be of great help in this struggle.
This is a ridiculous situation if you have presented all of the facts. I am quite sure you can get data from the two Associations listed in this column that will be of great help in this struggle.
Joel
22 Jan 2008, 22:51
22 Jan 2008, 22:51
My wife and I just built our dream house (~mid '07) and are experiencing
the same issues with large (>1/16") gaps appearing between the boards;
we have solid oak flooring and are running a heat-pump to ~20F outside temp
at which point it switches to gas back-up. I suspect our interior humidity
was approaching 15% last week prior to installation of a humidifier - which
our flooring contractor said wasn't necessary. The gaps have gotten large
enough to be a real eye sore. How do I tell if this is a moisture problem?
Was it created after the floors were laid or while the floors were laid
(i.e. was it improper installation or improper maintenance of the house)?
What are options for correcting the issue?
AsktheBuilder
23 Jan 2008, 16:21
23 Jan 2008, 16:21
Joel,
I think you are the cause. You need to keep the humidity pretty constant. Wood is a hygroscopic material.
I think you are the cause. You need to keep the humidity pretty constant. Wood is a hygroscopic material.
Joel
26 Jan 2008, 13:44
26 Jan 2008, 13:44
Everyone we talked to during construction, including multiple flooring
contractors told us humidifiers were not needed in our area.
Based upon what we now understand, if I can regain a reasonably constant relative humidity, we should see the problem go away? What should we expect to hold for a humidity range in our house?
Last week after a few calls, I finally convinced our flooring contractor to come examine what we have. His words were "it is as bad as I've ever seen it." He indicated that we should wait until next fall to see if it self corrects. Assuming it doesn't, he's suggesting we have him sand, fill, sand, and re-finish the entire floor. Is this a resonable fix, if it doesn't self correct?
Based upon what we now understand, if I can regain a reasonably constant relative humidity, we should see the problem go away? What should we expect to hold for a humidity range in our house?
Last week after a few calls, I finally convinced our flooring contractor to come examine what we have. His words were "it is as bad as I've ever seen it." He indicated that we should wait until next fall to see if it self corrects. Assuming it doesn't, he's suggesting we have him sand, fill, sand, and re-finish the entire floor. Is this a resonable fix, if it doesn't self correct?
AsktheBuilder
26 Jan 2008, 14:56
26 Jan 2008, 14:56
Joel,
Did you let the wood acclimate in the house for a week or more before installation?
Filling and sanding is acceptable. But ONLY after you stabilize the humidity.
Did you let the wood acclimate in the house for a week or more before installation?
Filling and sanding is acceptable. But ONLY after you stabilize the humidity.
Joel
27 Jan 2008, 22:24
27 Jan 2008, 22:24
Without looking at my notes, I believe the raw flooring was in the house
for roughly 5 days prior to being laid. It probably took another 1.5 weeks
to lay and sand the floor prior to finishing.
Our flooring sub said he tested the wood after he received it and before delivering it to our job-site. He said it tested a 6.7 on his moisture tester - he indicated normally a 7 is good.
Is one type of wood more inclided to swelling? We have a solid white oak floor in a select grade because we saw another floor just like it he did and were impressed.
Our flooring sub said he tested the wood after he received it and before delivering it to our job-site. He said it tested a 6.7 on his moisture tester - he indicated normally a 7 is good.
Is one type of wood more inclided to swelling? We have a solid white oak floor in a select grade because we saw another floor just like it he did and were impressed.
DAWN
31 Jan 2008, 11:57
31 Jan 2008, 11:57
hi,
I had a delivery to my home and they scratched up my 3" Engineered Amendoim flooring. I am trying to find out if i can just buff and re-surface vs. having the entire flooring replaced.
How can I tell if the damage is repairable vs. replaceable?
I had a delivery to my home and they scratched up my 3" Engineered Amendoim flooring. I am trying to find out if i can just buff and re-surface vs. having the entire flooring replaced.
How can I tell if the damage is repairable vs. replaceable?
AsktheBuilder
31 Jan 2008, 12:22
31 Jan 2008, 12:22
Dawn,
You may be in luck. I would call one or two wizards that may be in your town. Call the MOST expensive furniture showroom in your area. They have the phone numbers of these secret repairmen that come to your house with a magical wooden repair box that has an alcohol burner in it. If I tell you anymore, they will kill me. Once you see what they can do, you will also be sworn into the secret society.
You may be in luck. I would call one or two wizards that may be in your town. Call the MOST expensive furniture showroom in your area. They have the phone numbers of these secret repairmen that come to your house with a magical wooden repair box that has an alcohol burner in it. If I tell you anymore, they will kill me. Once you see what they can do, you will also be sworn into the secret society.
Bill
07 Jun 2008, 20:43
07 Jun 2008, 20:43
I would like to install a new hardwood floor over the existing sub floor in
my northern cottage. The issue is I close it down for the winter and am not
there all the time to control the humidity during the summer. Am I looking
at major problems if I proceed with the installation.
Thanks Bill
Thanks Bill
Pablo
13 Nov 2008, 18:50
13 Nov 2008, 18:50
Hi. If I read your article correctly water is hardwood floors enemy. Does
that include wood floors that have been varnished? There is an area
between the sink and my dishwasher where I believe constant water drippings
is harming the finish. When dishes are taken from the sink to the
dishwasher, water tends to drip in the same spot. Is the constant water
drips the cause of the finish wearing away? I think it is but my wife
doesn't think so.
Jamie Reckner
29 Jan 2009, 17:27
29 Jan 2009, 17:27
We just put a wood stove in our home. I would like a suggestion of the
best way to preserve my beautiful wood floors. I bought a humidifier,
thinking that it would help wood from drying out and cracking. Information
on your web site makes me believe that adding moisture offsets the humidity
level too much. How do I make that the humidity level is balanced?
Jason
09 Feb 2009, 16:58
09 Feb 2009, 16:58
Good information here. I have a question about prior moisture damage. I'm
considering purchasing a home that was built in 1960. It has maple floors
that are badly buckled. The owner claims there was no moisture barrier.
Could other parts of the house have been damaged by this over time? I'm
concerned about the walls, etc. Location - Costa Mesa, CA, 3 miles from
the beach.
Thanks, Jason
Thanks, Jason
Mike
30 Mar 2009, 14:34
30 Mar 2009, 14:34
Hi Tim,
You may remember me as I was your first commenter on this site (being sued over cracks in floor).
Despite the obvious problem with humidity in the owners home, they hired a "expert" to support their case of latent defect. I guess it would not be surprising to note that the "expert" dismissed the importance of home humidity during winter months, and of course pins the blame on installation conditions. It is almost as if he read your article in that he claimed the problem was due to excess humidity at time of installation speculatively based on:
1. assumed concrete in basement was done "after" wood floors was in the house.
2. humidity released by paint drying at time floor was installed;
3. failure to verify humidity of floors at time of installation;
4. inferior holding ability of staples versus nails;
5. recommended vapor barriers under all wooden floors (not a coding requirement).
Item 1 - 3 are false since the wood was conditioned and the house was at correct humidity level when floor was installed. I was hoping you could comment on item 4: Staples vs nails..are they equivalent or is one better. Also, item 5, in my opinion is false also. The expert speculates that excess humidity from the basement cause the wood to warp during installation and that a vapor barrier is required to protect against that. In a fully built home, humidity should be balanced across the whole home.
Anyhow, off to court in a few weeks (yup... 2 yrs later) and we will see how it goes.
Mike
You may remember me as I was your first commenter on this site (being sued over cracks in floor).
Despite the obvious problem with humidity in the owners home, they hired a "expert" to support their case of latent defect. I guess it would not be surprising to note that the "expert" dismissed the importance of home humidity during winter months, and of course pins the blame on installation conditions. It is almost as if he read your article in that he claimed the problem was due to excess humidity at time of installation speculatively based on:
1. assumed concrete in basement was done "after" wood floors was in the house.
2. humidity released by paint drying at time floor was installed;
3. failure to verify humidity of floors at time of installation;
4. inferior holding ability of staples versus nails;
5. recommended vapor barriers under all wooden floors (not a coding requirement).
Item 1 - 3 are false since the wood was conditioned and the house was at correct humidity level when floor was installed. I was hoping you could comment on item 4: Staples vs nails..are they equivalent or is one better. Also, item 5, in my opinion is false also. The expert speculates that excess humidity from the basement cause the wood to warp during installation and that a vapor barrier is required to protect against that. In a fully built home, humidity should be balanced across the whole home.
Anyhow, off to court in a few weeks (yup... 2 yrs later) and we will see how it goes.
Mike
Joy B
21 Jun 2009, 00:14
21 Jun 2009, 00:14
I recently purchased engineered hickory hardwood for my kitchen floor. Is
there any way to install the floor , that will prevent, liquids split on
the floor from falling between the boards. If not how would you get spilled
milk out from under the floor. Did I buy the wrong type of flooring
material?
thanks for your advise.
Joy
thanks for your advise.
Joy
kathy
26 Jun 2009, 14:12
26 Jun 2009, 14:12
I have a home that was built in the '40's with oak flooring. Most is
covered by carpeting. I am wanting to pull the carpeting and enjoy the
wood floors. I have done this in one of the room. The wood was in good
shape. I cleaned the floor and rewaxed it, this room requires frequent
rewaxing, not something I want to continue doing especially throughout the
entire house! You mentioned "screening" can you tell me more about this
for the DIY? My hope is there is an easier answer than sanding with the
power sander. I am wanting to remove the wax and finish with poly. Any
ideas for procedures and product recommendations?
dj
31 Jul 2009, 13:12
31 Jul 2009, 13:12
I recently finished sanding my hardwood floors. We are currently washing
down the walls to remove all the dust so we can stain and apply the
polyurathane. Last night during a rain storm and high humidity, it looks
as if someone sprayed water on the floor. In one corner of the room (close
to the patio door), the floor was pretty damp. The walls and ceiling are
completely dry. Could the wood soak up that much water from the humidity
to where it looked and felt damp? I plugged in a dehumidifier last night
and it took in water fairly quickly. Also, we are not living in the house
right now so there arent any windows and doors open or air conditioning
running. Would that make the situation worse?
Thanks!
DJ
Thanks!
DJ
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