Q&A / 

PR Blunders – How to Set Your House on Fire Fast

Torch Flame

See that cool blue flame? It's anything but cool. Put a sensor in the white area and it will probably measure 3,600 F. Copyright 2018 Tim Carter

PR Blunders - Be Very Careful and Use Common Sense

Published: January 17, 2018

I'm a member of the working press covering the home improvement beat. My syndicated newspaper column Ask the Builder still runs in sixty newspapers across the USA.

At the present time, public relations (PR) firms send me press releases each week sharing news about new building products. I received one this morning that had me shaking my head.

The press release is just below and I've included the grammar, misspelling and style errors.

I've DELETED the manufacturer and product name as well as the PR company/contact to avoid a legal dustup in case they feel I'm libeling them. Their names are really not that important. What you should focus on is the message in the press release.

After you read it, I'm going to slice and dice it for you.

Hi Tim,

As much as we’d like it to, home maintenance doesn’t stop when the temps drop. Cold weather means slippery sidewalks, frozen padlocks and high heating costs. I wanted to share some DIY tips and home hacks for the winter season that can be done with just one tool – a blowtorch.

Here are 6 (stylebook suggests spelling out 'six') easy to handle winter home hacks:

Don’t get locked out: Use a _____ torch to prevent lockouts by thawing a frozen padlock with a few quick strokes of heat.

Avoid slips and falls: Use that same ______ (or, the _______) to melt snow and slippery ice patches covering your walkway or steps. Then use a broom to brush away the rest. BONUS: This technique works faster than using salt.

Loosen your garden hose from the faucet: Use your ________ to loosen and remove a garden hose that is frozen to the spigot. Move the torch around the spigot to spread the heat around (don’t leave on one spot). This will keep cold air from freezing your pipes.

Replace old weather stripping: Make sure your windows are sealed to keep heating costs down. Use a  micro-torch to heat and remove old caulk and a paint scrapper (should only have one 'p') to peel away, then replace with new sealant.  

Stay warm with an indoor fire: Wood damp from snow? No problem - use a _____ torch to light logs for an indoor fire.

Light burners on a gas grill: In the event that burners are not working, use a ______ to light the grill. Just be sure to put the torch in the grill before you turn on the gas.

The torches are available at Home Depot as well as other national hardware retailers. Photos and more information is (should be 'are') available if you’re interested – please let me know what you think!

Thanks, PR Woman's Name / Firm Withheld

Master Plumbers and Blowtorches

I've been a master plumber since age 29. A blowtorch in conjunction with my lack of experience created a scar on my hand that's been there for about 30 years.

pr blunders

A third-degree burn scar is in the center of the red oval. Blowtorches can do serious harm in seconds. The voice of experience talking. Copyright 2018 Tim Carter

A drop of molten lead from a blowtorch dropped onto my hand while it was crammed into some tight framing. I was unable to move my hand to get rid of the sizzling metal and a third-degree burn was the end result.

A blowtorch fueled with propane develops a flame temperature of 3,600 F degrees.

propane filled cylinders

Propane can burn hot. You can melt several metals with this kind of heat. Combustibles ignite in seconds. Copyright 2018 Google, Inc.

If you decide to use a blowtorch fueled with propane anywhere around your home, you can start a fire in seconds. I know as I've started more than one house on fire while soldering copper fittings. Fortunately I had planned ahead and had buckets of water nearby in case something when wrong.

PR Blunders

The Internet is littered with thousands of blowtorch stories that ended badly. Some where people have died. It's insanity someone would recommend the use of open intense heat near combustible materials. Copyright 2018 Google Inc.

What's Wrong With This PR Blunder?

The first thing to remember is this press release is going to be printed word for word by many news outlets and a plethora of inexperienced hobby bloggers. You'll be able to do a Google search using quotation marks surrounding select sentences above to find news outlets where the above press release will be published in all its glory.

Young people who have never used a blowtorch are going to follow the tips.

Allow that to sink in. Young people will be working with open flames producing intense concentrated heat.

Another key point is the manufacturer of the blowtorch approved the press release. They are culpable for being the source of the questionable tips.

The manufacturer instructs the PR firm to put out messaging to sell product in different seasons. That's how it works. Ask any PR person.

Let's look at each of the six tips above:

Tip 1: Let's say that padlock is against a $6,000 fiberglass door. Within seconds you'll scorch the fiberglass. A painted wood or steel door will suffer immediate damage to the paint.

Tip 2: That 3,600 torch temperature is going to cause concrete to spall in just seconds. The rapid expansion of the ice-cold concrete will create pop outs in no time.

Tip 3: Have you ever been inside an old house to see what's behind a hose bib or faucet? You'll likely discover old newspapers, dust, wood chips from drilling the hole, etc. Hot gases from the torch can ignite those and a fire start all while you're outside using the blowtorch.

Tip 4: Want cold glass to crack? Remember, the tip is to do this now, not mid-summer. Just get a micro-torch tip near cold glass and watch what happens.

Tip 5: I'll grant them this tip. A blowtorch might help you get a wood fire going, but dry kindling is far better.

Tip 6: There's not a firefighter I know that would think using a propane torch is a good idea to light a grill that's malfunctioning. There's a reason the grill is not working right. Install new spark igniters.

PR Firms Have a Fiduciary Responsibility

I emailed the woman who sent me this press release warning her of the dangers.

She responded saying, "Thank you for your feedback. Each technique listed was vetted and approved by ________ engineering team for their safety."

I responded telling her that all she has to do is pass the press release by any firefighter and then added, "Your PR firm has a fiduciary duty to ensure the public is protected and for you to just *trust* the information given to you by the client is okay is naive at best."

An hour later she emailed saying, "Thank you for flagging your concerns. We are discussing with ______."

It's my opinion that PR firms have a responsibility to protect the public. These companies are paid professionals and if they belong to any associations they're bound by a code of ethics. The code of ethics for the Public Relations Society of America states:

  • Act promptly to correct erroneous communications for which the practitioner is responsible.

They shouldn't be going around spreading information that could harm or kill someone. They should push back against their clients and use common sense.

I'm waiting to see how long it takes for the PR firm to correct the erroneous information they circulated.

That's how I feel. What's your take? Leave a comment below.


101 Responses to PR Blunders – How to Set Your House on Fire Fast

  1. I am amazed that the PR firm would not acknowledge their error after you pointed out what is basic common sense - you don't put a flame near combustible material or use it for functions that it was not designed/intended for

  2. I agree with you 100%. We had a news story a few weeks ago where somebody set their house on fire while trying to thaw a frozen pipe.

  3. I live in the south where most homes have vinyl siding. Putting heat anywhere near it (like a hose bib) is definitely not a good idea.

  4. I think it's of utmost importance to remember that, once you put it "out there" with your name on it, you can be sued!

  5. Tim, I’m bc people like you use that stuff called common sense—- the stuff that’s not so common. Thank you for sharing this and the deadly concerns in case people would attempt these idiotic moves. May you continue to teach us all of the many things you do and may the youngin’s at these PR firms and in product development read, read, read and catch on to the wisdom available to them via the Internet. May they use their brains besides a block to keep their ears apart

  6. I don't even think it's about money. It's about ignorance. Keep pushing. And thank you Tim for the grammar correction.

  7. The part that is really amusing is that they recommend using one up against glass and a house wall (siding the outside faucet protrudes through) and expect nothing bad to happen but later they explicitly state that one can be used to start damp wood burning in a fireplace. Their liability insurers must live in complete terror of the claims that will surely roll in!!

  8. Wow. I hope that doesn't go out to the general public. Thanks for trying to protect those who don't know enough to protect themselves!

  9. Every year I read about all the fires started by using a propane torch by so called journeymen plumbers, roofers, etc. Not as many by DIY.

  10. This is unbelievable. I have no experience at all with using a blowtorch and even I can easily see how dangerous these "hacks" are. This is the kind of stuff that ends up as stupid videos on the internet. Praying that no one is seriously injured or killed.

  11. Whaaattt? Anybody who would make those suggestions has never used a blowtorch. This sounds like an episode of The Red-Green Show. Except the consequences are not funny.

  12. Tim:

    I read the first paragraph and I yelled for Susan to come here to read what this idiot is telling people to do. She even knew you shouldn't do that. Common sense and a little logic should tell a person not to do this. Thank you for trying to set these morons on the right path.

    • Loren,

      I felt you'd comment on this one. I'm not so shocked about the PR firm, but have grave concerns about the manufacturer of the blowtorch disseminating reckless tips like this.

  13. I apologize for my crude way of putting things, but I constantly encounter people in the building trade, commercial settings, & even in the medical field who are talking out of their heads. They are representing themselves to be experts in their field, but have no real knowledge of the subject matter of which they speak. It's very unsettling!

  14. It is a problem with younger people in the work force. They do not know what they are talking about and they have never used to torch for welding/soldering, or have any clue how hot the tip of the propane torch actually gets.
    Nothing against the younger people, but they might be super good writers, but they have no idea what what they are writing about. I sure hope all of my words are correct or they will be after me !!!!!!!!!

    • Glenn (and Tim)
      You hit the nail on the head in the very first sentence-younger people in the workforce. As much as I hate to generalize because I do work with some intelligent young people, the common sense is lacking and if they don't know the answer the Omni Powerful Google must! That's where it goes full circle-they read nonsense like this PR firm publishes and say "hey-if it's on Google it must be true!". Wrong. Or these You Tube videos made by some kid with his first car explaining the proper way to remove something. Scary stuff.
      How about we start a petition to put a common sense course on the curriculum of all colleges? At least they would stand a chance. Then again, who will teach it? The 26 year old with a master's in education?

  15. Dead right Tim.
    Why don't ppl learn this kind of info ONCE ?
    Not multiple times, across generations.
    Well said & keep talking up.

  16. Most people only know about DIY from television and other media. They often do not possess the skills nor have the experience necessary to judge when a project can get them in trouble. When companies put out suggested usages for products most will accept them without question. As a Public Safety Officer, I have seen what happens when things go wrong. If people follow these suggested applications that could easily happen.

  17. I suppose it comes down to the almighty dollar again.. If it isn't about the sales it's about the PR firm getting paid to make the product sound good.Your warnings to them should be enough for them to re-think their position on this matter. Thank God there are people like you out there to impart knowledge and experience to prove a point.

  18. I always remember the warning on a package of Black Cat Fire crackers from my youth: "Light fuse, get away" Not to make light of it but the warning seemed a bit obvious and primarily geared towards the avoidance of law suites. It seems like a strange swing to the far end of the spectrum for the blow torch folks to take such a willy-nilly approach to there advertising...

  19. Thawing a frozen pipe with a blow torch is crazy. If the house doesn’t catch fire, the ice can turn to steam in a heartbeat and blow the pipe wide open. Ouch!

  20. I suspect the PR firm is pleasing a client. Gotta wonder about the engineering team thing but I am a retired engineer and know you don't learn everything about everything and at least where I went, instead of learning practical stuff, you learn lots of mathematical stuff you never see again after school. The professors are not from the working world, they are products of the university world. May have come up with ideas for things the torch can do but don't think they knew of the potential problems. No doubt the manufacturer would be the deep pockets the attorneys would go after.

  21. Using a blow torch for any one of those reasons stated by the PR firm needs to be shut down. If this was passed on by their engineers, they need to lose their licenses. This is insane.

  22. Wow, that's crazy. It's like recommending a chainsaw for trimming your moustache. Hard to believe this isn't a skit on Saturday Night Live.

  23. As bad as these "tips" are, at least they didn't suggest using your knees to hold a lit torch while your hands were busy. Yep, it happened; yep, I was on the ambulance crew. One of those things that you only do once in life.

  24. I agree with everything mentioned. Thanks for the "heads up" Common cents still trumps it all, but experience makes common cents sometimes.

  25. Hi, You are so right. A propane torch must be used carefully. Please think ahead, like you say, before you light it.

  26. Good job Tim. Let's hope they can repair the damage, but if their tips got out there it may be too late for some people to see a retraction. Thanks for all the good tips and wisdom you share with us.

  27. If you don't learn from somebody else's mistake experience then you will learn on your own if you repeat their experience mistakes. Use common sense as that open hot flame is dangerous if misused!

  28. Caveat Emptor! Ralph Nader came on the scene back in the 1960s so people became more aware of products and manufacturing and ingredients and safety warnings. It's still Buyer Beware!

  29. I will tell you an easy way to thaw out a frozen padlock. put a mixture of rubbing alcohol and water in a spray bottle. spray the lock with it. Thaws out immediately. Worked for me recently in 10 deg weather. I took the lock in the house to dry it out. Using a propane torch to thaw anything is a recipe for disaster.

  30. 20 below zero weather brings out the dopes setting fire to their houses by trying to thaw out pipes.

    Propane torches have their uses. An oxy-propane torch is almost as hot as acetylene, and a lot cheaper.

  31. Just make sure your homeowners insurance is paid up and current before you listen to this sale hype! But I bet that somewhere in the literature that comes with the torch comes with some warning and / or at least a disclaimer of liability for the improper use of their product.

  32. Hacks by idiots!! I would NEVER use a blowtorch for any of these so-called tips. The company's law firm had better get ready for multiple lawsuits ASAP!!

  33. I would hope all companies involved would get sued and lose except, that would mean someone/thing was seriously hurt/destroyed because of their greed, selfishness, etc. . . I wouldn't want that. Let's just hope and pray no one practices their hacks.

  34. First off, thank you Tim for sharing your wisdom. We all owe it to others to bring this nonsense to light.

    As I stated in one of your other recent columns many young people in business don't don't get it because they haven't been around as long as us. They are lacking in wisdom because they haven't been on the planet long enough in many cases. Still no excuse. One lives and learns like you did with the evidence of the scar on your hand. It takes time to learn...often the hard way.

    Besides burning down a house or killing someone, serious injuries can happen with exploding glass and concrete that shatters due to the violent change in temperature brought about by a torch. It would be easy to blind oneself with exploding fragments.

    If I were the Insurance company, I would pay the claim, give them a stern warning and then send them packing to find another insurance carrier. They
    should not be or feel rewarded for doing something stupid. Would you want them as a repeat customer?

  35. That's the difference between experience in common sense and innocence in the younger generation. People doing things they know about PR and not knowing about, like "trades" safety and non-PR things.

  36. Well maybe this company makes a flamethrower that we can use to light a fire in a fireplace in our homes. Please people, use a little common sence.

  37. It is obvious that those morons at the pr firm have never used a blowtorch. I especially enjoyed the suggestion that you remove ice from cement or concrete with a blowtorch. You have never felt pain until you have a chunk of concrete blow off of the sidewalk and land inside your leather glove and cook your hand until you get the glove off. If you must thaw a pipe or something there is a small inexpensive tool called a heat gun. As long as you don't just sit there with it in a concentrated area you may be able to get some relief. Best thing to do if you have to unfreeze a faucet against a vinyl or some surface that maybe damaged is to wrap one of those heat strips you can buy from Lowe's for about 22 bucks,plug it in and wait. It certainly beats calling the fire department..or the siding contractor.

  38. The daughter of a friend of mine watched her landlord use a torch to thaw a water line in the closet in the basement apartment she was renting. Around 03:00 in the morning the daughter heard crackling and opened the closet door to see fire. End result, she lost most of her belongings and the other apartment renters were having to find new places as well. This happened during a spell of -30C weather. Glad you took on the PR firm.

  39. You seem to be very knowledgeable and technically competent. You might want to focus on your people skills and PR skills as in several of your write-ups you come across as arrogant and a know it all and that may be why no one has contracted your services! And why people aren't open to your suggestions. Many times the approach is more important than the messege itself!

    • Thanks Larry for your insight. I don't like to start confrontations, but if invited to one, I'm usually all in.

      The companies making these mistakes need to be called out. You may feel it's arrogant, but others may call it Tough Love.

      Call it what you will, but by the time it gets this far it's time to be forthright and call a spade a spade.

      I'll close with the fact that I'm over 65 years old and you know what they say about old people....

  40. Holy Cow! The company's techniques for using their torch about the same as if we had hunted jack rabbits instead of a .22 using a 50 cal.

  41. Your comments & recommendations are correct. It IS a sign of our times.... THEIR business is to make sales... REGARDLESS of consequences... They're irresponsible & a death will be an INCIDENT that somebody's life is DONE... and their jobs will continue... Unfortunate & true. Thank you for your outright honesty with them. Their PR program is WRONG... they likely will NOT admit it and justify their reasoning. AGAIN, our responsibility more & more is we, as humans & citizens MUST TAKE CARE OF OURSELVES.... Publicity is OFTEN not revealing the entire truths, leaving the public as VICTIMS of misinformation by companies that have NO REGARD for our safety, health, wellbeing. Our gov't is corrupt & sanctioning gmo's & prescription drugs without long term testing etc etc... WE as humans & citizens MUST stand up & take back our power & NOT condone or purchase products from companies that disregard honesty for the sake of the almighty dollar.. at WHATEVER costs.

  42. I would hope that uninformed readers (like myself) would read this press release with skepticism, and think through the “helpful” suggestions before implementing. Nevertheless, companies can not and should not rely on hope—they need to ensure their products and advice are as idiot-proof as possible, both as a matter of corporate responsibility, and to limit their legal exposure.

  43. You are correct for:
    1. Fundamental common sense
    2. The functions of a PR firm: recommend which means of advertising will be the most effective; grill the client to learn everything about their product; and quietly seek advice from both product experts and product liability lawyers about any safety issues
    3. Courtroom losers: very likely the manufacturer and possibly the PR firm. (If your exchanges with the PR firm were evidence in a product liability case I would expect they would end up splitting payment of the jury award).

  44. This is a company that is desperate to improve the profitability of a failing product so they disregard common sense and have now put their company at risk. More importantly, they are putting the general public at risk because too many people disregard common sense especially when a company recommends a solution to a problem.

  45. As time goes on the number of people that have experience using tools as a propane torch goes down also they don’t stop to think either. I would not trust either the PR firm or the manufacturer’s “engineers”.

  46. Tim,
    Thanks for helping to keep all of us safe when working on our homes. I enjoy your posts very much and use your information on a regular basis.
    Keep up the good work!

  47. We use hot torches at our shop all the time and have been for years. Even today I worry about the molten metal splatter causing a hidden fire. We also have multiple fire extinguishers in case of fires. The average person does not. People are going to take chances. I was young and dumb once and took chances. But to put out a PR statement about the use of propane torches and not have a proper safe handling procedure to go along with such a device is stupid.

    • Jon,

      Oh yes! That's why I went to all the work to create this page. Were you able to digest what I wrote when I sliced and diced the release for you?

      Are you aware plumbers oversized the hole for a hose bib? Do you know many don't brush out the hole of all the dust and wood chips?

      Yes, I've used a torch on cold concrete. Within a few seconds you blow up the surface of the concrete.

      Yes, I've put a propane torch near cold glass. It cracks within seconds.

      A close friend of mine almost has his house burn to the ground when he used a propane torch to light his gas grill.

      Should I keep going?

  48. To All,

    When I feel compelled to use such a torch I do keep a fire extinguisher handy and use a Dutch-lap shingle behind the targeted area. Safety glasses are required.
    Keep the area ventilated, but not a fan.

    Roofing Sheet Metal Contractor (retired 1957-2005)

  49. Just goes to show you how really stupid so called educated people are. Tim, thank you for your service to us DIY guys and girls.

  50. Tim, it's sadly funny that the PR person wanted to nullify your comments by telling you all the suggested uses of the torch had been vetted by the client. She probably didn't even finish reading your (negative) comments before she was firing back her response about the vetting of the uses of the torch.
    Keep spreading the truth Tim, you have lots of supporters out here.

  51. This sounds like another example of young people with no first-hand, hands-on DIY experience or journalism training issuing a press release. Remember the clothing stores that advertised clothing with racist or sexist sayings printed on it, or the cute little top that looked like what was worn in Nazi concentration camps? I'm sure both the PR firm and the manufacturer will be spending some time in court soon, defending themselves after a few houses burn down, especially from that hose idea. And as a journalist and former government public information officer who has handled thousands of press releases, I'm shocked at the unprofessionalism of the release itself. (shakes head)

  52. The older I get, the more it seems that common sense, thought, and reason have gone by the wayside. Personal / legal responsibility seem to have been discarded as well.

  53. I was soldering copper pipe in my basement ceiling that led to an outside hose bib and the tar paper between the sub floor and the finished floor began smoldering. I quickly doused it with a garden hose. I did keep an eye on it to make sure the fire was out. Since then I use a piece of scrap sheet metal to divert the heat and flame away from any flammable materials.

    Using a torch to thaw frozen pipes? Every time I read a safety article, it says never use an open flame to thaw pipes.

    These tips are so insane!

    Tim, please keep up the good work. Your hints are invaluable.

  54. This is unbelievable. Anyone with a particle of diy experience and a little common sense knows how foolish this information is. The PR firm is definitely ignorant in the use of a blowtorch. You did a great service to point this out.

  55. I'm not surprised, $$ outweighs common sense or responsibilities. In a world where everyone is more concernes with themselves, this is the kind of stuff we get, and besides, we need to thin the heard anyway. #Darwin

  56. If the hose bib trick doesn't light your house on fire it probably will achieve the result by melting the hose.
    Anybody heard of a wrench?

  57. Everyone beware ! Safety and common sense comes first and do not take dumb chances OR here today gone tomorrow will happen to you.

  58. Ignorance is bliss! A similar 'High Heat' story, shopping for a new BBQ in a nationally known outlet, the salesman said, "And this unit has a special 18,000 degree burner that will sear a steak like you won't believe." I commented, "Do you know lava is about 2000 degrees?" He responded, "Wouldn't know about that." Of course he should have said 18,000 BTU's.

  59. they really blew it. they should have recommended using mapp gas instead of propane......mapp gas burns hotter !!!!!!!!!

  60. One of the few DIY projects I will not undertake is soldering copper pipes. Too risky for me. I don't own a torch and never will. Thanks for warning others.

  61. Sad but true for most PR and Marketing is they get paid by what they write and usually have nothing to do with the product, it's about the money. Doesn't sound like the writer knows what a blowtorch is let alone what it is used for. Most cases they get paid before writing anything so they are bias from the start using the PR or Marketing firm's brand name as being credible, if they said it it must be true. In addition, they probably took the lazy way out and sent to Tim knowing he would respond doing their work for them. Seriously doubt any engineer would OK any of it. Would like to see where their article was published.

  62. Good for you, Tim. Unfortunately, people today are too quick to take things at face value. Common sense is no longer common.

  63. Tim - You are right on all counts. I'm not a plumber, but my father was and he taught me how to sweat joints & do some plumbing. I've nearly started a few fires in my own home a few times, but was prepared knowing the possibility of it. A young novice would no doubt be in trouble fast. Plus all the damage they would do putting heat to doors, concrete and glass.

  64. OMG Thanks so much for posting this. I can see a lot of people trusting this info and getting hurt or causing serious damage to stuff. A blow torch and a barbecue grill should never be used together, good grief!!!

  65. If you google: propane flame temperature, you will quickly find the site of a well-known brand of torch. One of the first pictures shown in the "How To" section is some ass hat "working" on a motorcycle with a torch in hand, 4-6 inches away from the gas tank. I'm a certified Welder, a Welding Instructor and I have many motorcycles. I'm 63 years old and if you came that close to one of my bikes with a lit torch, you'd die. I promise. I can't believe the stupidity in promoting such dangerous behavior. Might be the same company that you're talking about Tim.

  66. This article reminds me of the saying: "You can train novices to become good technicians, but you can't fix stupid!" If that PR firm actually published that drivel, they should be sued out of business.

    Any time I've sweated copper plumbing joints against wooden joists I've placed a sheet of ~16ga steel sheet metal between the copper pipe & the joist, to act as a heat sink & shield the wood from the flame, as my dad taught me years ago. And always have a filled water sprayer with me, just in-case. Have never yet had a problem & pray that I never do. But being prepared helps!

  67. She responded saying, "Thank you for your feedback. Each technique listed was vetted and approved by ________ engineering team for their safety."

    Obviously no fire protection engineers on their team...

  68. I think that one way to make your point ask her to get actively involved in her product she is promoting and go out and do each and every task that she suggests. If she does it the result will be a bunch of experience gained by her. She may learn to know what she is talking about other than just randomly writing STUFF.
    I suspect she will burn a door, wreck a walkway, have to buy a new hose and so on. Then if she persists and gets to the last step accumulated propane will explode and really get her attention. Question any chance she never forwarded your comments? She clearly never tried any of her ideas. The idea of melting stuff on a walk is like using a nail gun to put a button on a shirt.

  69. Thank you Tim for stepping up and pointing out erroneous uses with tools and the dangers they present. Just this winter alone, I have read about three homes on fire due to using a blow torch to unfreeze frozen pipes. YIKES!!! Please keep up the great work that you do.

  70. Obvious from your email exchange that in a legal dispute the PR firm would claim they relied on the "expert opinion" of the "engineering team".

    Reminds me of Enron and other infamous companies where the executives/companies duck and cover behind lawyers, accountants and engineers, despite what should be common sense.

Leave a Reply

You have to agree to the comment policy.